Board index Discussion Music Discussion

do you guys use send channels a lot?

Talk about all music related topics
Post a reply
21 posts • Page 1 of 31, 2, 3

do you guys use send channels a lot?

Postby Jesse Gorter » Wed Jul 20, 2011 8:37 pm

do you guys use these channels a lot?
For example, I tried today to send all beats to one send channel and all the basses to another, and then a channel for strings and one for the main instruments.
Is this a good approach for mixing in your book? What are the advantages or disadvantages?
http://soundcloud.com/jessegorter/
User avatar
Jesse Gorter
Major
Major
 
Posts: 1122
Joined: Sun Mar 23, 2008 7:26 pm

Re: do you guys use send channels a lot?

Postby Highvoltage » Wed Jul 20, 2011 9:07 pm

yes its the way to go, but don't confuse send channels with subgroups.
Send channels are for commonly used fx across tracks, (mosly) like reverb and delay. You set the fx on the send channels 100% wet (or at least the last one in the chain), and then you can send the audio to those channels with different amounts to get reveb/delay accordingly.

It sounds to me that youre talking about making groups of instruments. (dunno how it works with reason, but last time i checked it had no option for making subgroup channels specifically, but you can do it rather easily by making a mixer for each subgroup (what a waste of screen space). Is this the way you're doing it? Or as i see you can use the Spider audio merger for 4 channels (no level setting? WTF seriously.. thats fucking stupid propellerhead)

But yeah.. if you manage to do submixes its great on so many levels. I constantly have a Drum submix, Bass, Guitars, Vocals, FX, the rest subgroups, and many times i make specific subgroups for different tasks as they come along.

It is the way all engineers mix. The most apparent benefit is that you can set your whole group's volume and panning with one knob, leaving the inner volume proportions intact. Second best thing is, that you can apply fx to the whole group, and its very different than adding them separately. Especially for example when you compress a drumgroup, it will react to the whole group's dynamics, and you can easily glue the sumbix together. Add a very slight saturation to the whole group, and the drums start to behave like they are meant to be together. etc..

Cant point any disadvantages of subgroups, if used logically.
User avatar
Highvoltage
Lieutenant Colonel
Lieutenant Colonel
 
Posts: 2076
Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2007 1:57 pm
Location: pécs, hungary

Re: do you guys use send channels a lot?

Postby Highvoltage » Wed Jul 20, 2011 9:15 pm

On the other hand you can use send channels not just for reverbs and delays shit, it's also a great place the fuck around.

add a fucked up distortion to a send channel, maybe eq out the lows after it, and you can send some beats and basses to taste on that channel, and just ever slightly add that to the mix. Same with compressors. Its called 'New York compression' or "parallel compression" when you send a drumgroup to a channel with a cranked up compressor, and you can blend the very compressed signal with the dry to taste. It can result in a huge sound, but keeping the original dynamics and punch somewhat intact.

etc.. again
User avatar
Highvoltage
Lieutenant Colonel
Lieutenant Colonel
 
Posts: 2076
Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2007 1:57 pm
Location: pécs, hungary

Re: do you guys use send channels a lot?

Postby Jesse Gorter » Wed Jul 20, 2011 9:49 pm

ok wow that sounds cool.
Nah I use them in Abeton as sort of subgroups because you can set a channel to 'send only', so I use return channel (or is it called send channel? well i forgot, those channels next to the master channel in ableton) as a channel where I send all my drums to. And the seperate channels do not send audio anymore to the master channel, they all go via the send.
Maybe that's not the way to go but I am not sure if there's another way to do it in ableton.

In reason, yeah I guess I would use an extra mixer or something, but I rarely try to mix properly in reason yet
http://soundcloud.com/jessegorter/
User avatar
Jesse Gorter
Major
Major
 
Posts: 1122
Joined: Sun Mar 23, 2008 7:26 pm

Re: do you guys use send channels a lot?

Postby Aquila » Wed Jul 20, 2011 10:05 pm

Highvoltage wrote:Its called 'New York compression' or "parallel compression"


I've never had much luck with parallel compression. I find that the compressor adds a couple ms delay to the signal and when mixed back causes all sorts of phase and flange issues.
Est. 1981
User avatar
Aquila
Lieutenant Colonel
Lieutenant Colonel
 
Posts: 1619
Joined: Fri Sep 14, 2007 9:26 am
Location: Cairns, Australia

Re: do you guys use send channels a lot?

Postby ulonix » Thu Jul 21, 2011 5:25 am

Highvoltage wrote:On the other hand you can use send channels not just for reverbs and delays shit, it's also a great place the fuck around.

add a fucked up distortion to a send channel, maybe eq out the lows after it, and you can send some beats and basses to taste on that channel, and just ever slightly add that to the mix. Same with compressors. Its called 'New York compression' or "parallel compression" when you send a drumgroup to a channel with a cranked up compressor, and you can blend the very compressed signal with the dry to taste. It can result in a huge sound, but keeping the original dynamics and punch somewhat intact.

etc.. again



Y.B
http://www.twotigersmusic.net
User avatar
ulonix
Captain
Captain
 
Posts: 778
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2007 12:14 am
Location: Santiago , Chile

Re: do you guys use send channels a lot?

Postby Highvoltage » Thu Jul 21, 2011 11:17 am

Aquila wrote:
Highvoltage wrote:Its called 'New York compression' or "parallel compression"


I've never had much luck with parallel compression. I find that the compressor adds a couple ms delay to the signal and when mixed back causes all sorts of phase and flange issues.


yes, delays can be an issue here (and phaseshift too, which is a different thing)
What daw? In cubase i never had problems with any compressor. You can use Voxengo's sample delay plugin (or something) to shift back to phase, but thats kind of a hassle. There are compressors with dry/wet knobs doing this whole shit easily. (like rocket, the glue, etc)
User avatar
Highvoltage
Lieutenant Colonel
Lieutenant Colonel
 
Posts: 2076
Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2007 1:57 pm
Location: pécs, hungary

Re: do you guys use send channels a lot?

Postby Highvoltage » Thu Jul 21, 2011 11:27 am

Jesse Gorter wrote:ok wow that sounds cool.
Nah I use them in Abeton as sort of subgroups because you can set a channel to 'send only', so I use return channel (or is it called send channel? well i forgot, those channels next to the master channel in ableton) as a channel where I send all my drums to. And the seperate channels do not send audio anymore to the master channel, they all go via the send.
Maybe that's not the way to go but I am not sure if there's another way to do it in ableton.

In reason, yeah I guess I would use an extra mixer or something, but I rarely try to mix properly in reason yet


Yeah, you are using the send channels like i described, this can be done much easier in Live.
Live supports group channels, but ask Luxonix i think he can tell you better. You basically route the audio to an empty audio channel.
wait... google is my pal
http://www.wiretotheear.com/2008/03/25/ ... ally-easy/

but i remember doing this even easier somehow just pressing ctrl+G on a bunch of selected tracks. but maybe not
User avatar
Highvoltage
Lieutenant Colonel
Lieutenant Colonel
 
Posts: 2076
Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2007 1:57 pm
Location: pécs, hungary

Re: do you guys use send channels a lot?

Postby ulonix » Thu Jul 21, 2011 2:21 pm

Aquila wrote:
Highvoltage wrote:Its called 'New York compression' or "parallel compression"


I've never had much luck with parallel compression. I find that the compressor adds a couple ms delay to the signal and when mixed back causes all sorts of phase and flange issues.



Does your daw support auto pdc?, maybe it's realated to that
http://www.twotigersmusic.net
User avatar
ulonix
Captain
Captain
 
Posts: 778
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2007 12:14 am
Location: Santiago , Chile

Re: do you guys use send channels a lot?

Postby Jesse Gorter » Thu Jul 21, 2011 7:29 pm

Highvoltage wrote:
Jesse Gorter wrote:ok wow that sounds cool.
Nah I use them in Abeton as sort of subgroups because you can set a channel to 'send only', so I use return channel (or is it called send channel? well i forgot, those channels next to the master channel in ableton) as a channel where I send all my drums to. And the seperate channels do not send audio anymore to the master channel, they all go via the send.
Maybe that's not the way to go but I am not sure if there's another way to do it in ableton.

In reason, yeah I guess I would use an extra mixer or something, but I rarely try to mix properly in reason yet


Yeah, you are using the send channels like i described, this can be done much easier in Live.
Live supports group channels, but ask Luxonix i think he can tell you better. You basically route the audio to an empty audio channel.
wait... google is my pal
http://www.wiretotheear.com/2008/03/25/ ... ally-easy/

but i remember doing this even easier somehow just pressing ctrl+G on a bunch of selected tracks. but maybe not


Thanks i found it! Much better. Now to play with sends. I did a new mix and it all just sounds soo much better already. I also took the real inaudible bass out of the hi strings and mainmelody, and the very hi-end of the basses.
http://soundcloud.com/jessegorter/
User avatar
Jesse Gorter
Major
Major
 
Posts: 1122
Joined: Sun Mar 23, 2008 7:26 pm

21 posts • Page 1 of 31, 2, 3
Post a reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests

cron